how many states are gonig to ban pipes? i heard theres going to be a few. i think it's a crock! look at the harleys, their loud as hell.and they don't get bothered

I agree, there are more motorcyles with loud pipes than snowmobiles. *What's the big deal as long as they are not too loud, *the quieter the better. *Everyone knows a Harley is not quiet with pipes.

I doo have to agree with you. *It's only a matter of time before they put the brakes on snowmobile pipes. I also agree with your comment about the Harley's. *I HATE summer because *no snow (of course) and loud harley's at 2:30 am l eaving the bar. *I have 2 boys that think it is great to run to the window and watch the Harley idiot's burn their back tires off, after they let them warm up for a 1/2 hour. Oh ya have to love it to when they leave town ( At anytime of the day 30mph speed limit ) and grab 3-4 gears and redlineing them in every grear. *I think if they are going to ban pipes, they should not ONLY target snowmobiles. *There is loud cars, trucks, boats, jet ski's, bikes, street and dirt, along with alot of other things. Ban them ALL or leave us alone!

Loud and proud!

The issue with this is that snowmobiles are on trails in most places where Landowners grant the PRIVILEGE of allowing us to ride their land. Harleys also have the Privilege of riding on the road, but where do you see gates to block access to most roads, you dont. Lakes need no preparation for a jet-ski to go on it. Most of us ride groomed trails. My point is we are over a barrel, no permission= no maintained trails= no riding for us. I agree about Musclecars, Harleys and such being loud as well, but you cant go out and put a gate on your street to keep them out, but with a sled trail you can! Thats the difference.

In Wisconsin, if you get caught with any silencer that is not stock, you will get a ticket. *It doesn't even matter if the pipes you are running are actually quieter than stock, you will still get a ticket. *How much sense does that make? http://www.snowmobileworld.com/forums/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif

There is a guy that lives down the street from me that has a very loud newer Honda road bike.All summer long that loud,abnoxous POS goes by my house.One day I counted,26 times I had to listen to that thing go by in one day.And of course he has to wind the pi$$ out of it.Just think of the people that give you permission to ride on their property.They don't want to hear those loud sled pipes.More trails have to be rerouted due to loud pipes.People just don't like the noise.I don't like the sound of a sled when it sounds like a chainsaw.Keep em stock,keep the trails.

I have to agree with slarson, but really what is too loud? *I know they have a meter to measure noise level, but a stock MXZ 700 after 400 miles is not very quiet. *Who makes the decision? *That is the question, and the answer is: * The people that open up their property for us to ride on.

I dont know what is really too loud??? But I can say this, all the manufacturers know noise keeps becoming a greater issue because in general their sleds keep getting quieter year after year * http://www.snowmobileworld.com/forums/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif

Slarson said it ALL! Everyone read his first post again and again until you get it.
It"s not fair but that"s the way it is in the snowmobile world!
If you want to buck the system, then it will only be a short time before everyone"s $8000.00 + sled{s} is a lawn ornament http://www.snowmobileworld.com/forums/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

The level of noise is not the issue. It seems to have become the American way to complain, that is the issue.
Quieter does prevent the complaining from happening as often.
BUT the ones who complain about the "loud" snowmobiles will always think they are loud .
As for motorcycles, we are going through the same issues of people complaining about the noise.
If you think they can't ban loud vehicles from the roads, you should check your local ordinances. They will impound loud Bikes in some areas.
It is WAY easier to put a law on the books than to take them off. (do not drive a red car in Minnesota)(and if you are in a covered wagon in ND you can shoot indians) as examples of old laws.
"Make a law!" they yell at the representatives and congresspersons. Then, later, when they get affected by some other law (that was created by some other complainer) they complain about the law.
Every law that is made to protect someone's freedom takes freedom from somewhere else, when done properly it works well.
The law in Minnesota reads "For any snowmobile built after April 1 1975, Max 78 decibles at 50 feet on the A scale" http://www.snowmobileworld.com/forums/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

I dont mind loud pipes on anything,I have them on my car,truck,cycle,and sometimes Ill throw a stinger on the sled.I cant really agree with putting Harleys on the same level as a sled though,If you think about it,you dont have Harleys running in the backwoods on private land right next to someones home,at least not that I know of http://www.snowmobileworld.com/forums/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif Everything is loud in the city,I would think that most of the complainers would be the ones who are leaving the city in search of some "piece&quiet"Me personally,I head upnorth to have a good time.(which is about the only place I can get away with changing my pipe for a couple of lake runs)Just my opinion. http://www.snowmobileworld.com/forums/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

http://www.snowmobileworld.com/forums/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif
PERSONALLY, I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY THE LAW ENFORCEMENT PEOPLE HERE IN WISCONSIN HAVE NO BALLS TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT THE HARLEY *EXHAUST NOISE.
JUST BECAUSE HARLEYS ARE HEADQUARTERED IN WISCONSIN, THEY ARE UNTOUCHABLE IT APPEARS.... *AS FAR AS HARLEYS NOT BEING ON PRIVATE PROPERTY AS IT IS IN SNOWMOBILING, *THEY ARE ON ROADS MY TAX DOLLARS SUPPORT. *I LIVE ACROSS THE ROAD FROM A SNOWMOBILE TRAIL JUST OUTSIDE OF TOWN, *ABOUT A MILE, AND HARLEYS GO BY IN NUMBERS DURING WARM MONTHS. THE ISSUE I'VE GOT IS I HAVE TO TURN THE VOLUME UP ON MY TV AT NIGHT EVEN WHEN I HAVE THE AIR CONDITIONER ON & THE WINDOWS CLOSED. DOESN'T THIS COMPARE WITH SNOWMOBILE EXHAUST NOISE COMPLAINTS? WHERE DO MY RIGHTS COME IN ? WHY DO LANDOWNERS PROVIDING SNOWMOBILE TRAIL ACCESS HAVE BETTER LAW ENFORCEMENT ( DEPT. OF NATURAL RESOURCES ) THAN PUBLIC ROADS? *ON MILTON AVENUE IN JANESVILLE, WI. THE COPS JUST IGNORE THESE TWO WHEELED JOHN DEERE TRACTORS NAMED HARLEYS WHEN THEY HAVE LOUD EXHAUST... *WHERE IS THE PARITY IN ENFORCEMENT? *NONE IN WISCONSIN !! YEAH, WE NEED TO KEEP OUR TRAILS.... THE LANDOWNERS DESERVE THEIR RIGHTS AS WELL.... *WHERE IS IT WHEN IT COMES TO HARLEYS???
http://www.snowmobileworld.com/forums/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif

I agree with Zertma8, *just cause we live in WI it is alright for Harleys too be loud?! *What the hell. *Our sleds are nothing compared to loud pipes on Harleys, *I also pay for the roads, *Our WI enforcement is bullshit! http://www.snowmobileworld.com/forums/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif

THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH WISCONSIN...its the fact of piece and quite for people that are not into the same thing as us and the backwoods.Like I said I have no problem with loudness,but everyone else has their right to B#@*#just as you do as a taxpayer!(unlike motorcycles,snowmobile access across private land is a gift not a right&#33http://www.snowmobileworld.com/forums/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif *http://www.snowmobileworld.com/forums/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

will this debate ever end lol . then as now

Fortunately Since this thread was started waaaaaay back in 2002. the laws in Wi have changed. When they decided to institute the night time speed limit they added into that particular senate bill, a revised sound decibel limit of somewhere around 88 db. Here's a good one thou... Back around 03/04 a well known northwoods sno club did a test on their diesel groomer on a trail at full speed. It registered a higher db reading than what was then allowed at the time (+78db)

will this debate ever end lol . then as now[/b]
I'll bet it doesnt go on much more than 5 years after every last trail has closed. :confused:

Nova Scotia has put a decible law into affect now as well, and the sled can not be modified to be louder than when it left the manufacturing plant .

now if they got the government gets there head out of there ##### and ban those cherry bomb mufflers for cars i would be happy. have to love it at 2 in the morning all you hear is those things

The Quebec Transportation Code states "No Modification to the Exhaust System" and goes on to say you are not permitted to defeat any safety systems or warning devices. I had a discussion with a lawmaker concerning the giant "Warning" labels festooned all over the cab and clutch guards and he said those are what are implied. Again, silly reasoning not designed to work with the groups but to mandate what they can & cannot do.

I have had some of my landowners complain about the sleds with pipes going past their house at midnight waking them up. They weren't too happy. In the winter time we have the advantage of closed windows to muffle the noise to the inhabitants of the homes we pass. The aftermarket pipes quite often add a certain amount of vibration to their sound to irritate the homeowner as they pass.

This problem is going to make trail access difficult as our local small communities seem to spreading quite rapidly here. The subdivisions are now along side our trails. Even though we were there first who do you think the local councils are going to listen to? I have been told it is going to be a battle getting better community access trails by some members of the township government as they don't want to deal with the complaints that will be generated by the adjacent homeowners.

Keeping sleds quiet is in our own best interest.

I dont care for loud sleds but its not the pipe that makes the sled loud it the muffler/can or stinger whatever you want to call it.I have a dyno port pipe with a stock muffler and my sled is no louder than it was with the stock pipe.Whats a snowmobiler to doo if you have an older machine and cant get stock replcement exhuast?

The Quebec Transportation Code states "No Modification to the Exhaust System" and goes on to say you are not permitted to defeat any safety systems or warning devices. I had a discussion with a lawmaker concerning the giant "Warning" labels festooned all over the cab and clutch guards and he said those are what are implied. Again, silly reasoning not designed to work with the groups but to mandate what they can & cannot do.[/b]
Loud sleds have no place on the trail in my humble opinion. Michigan might have a law, but it is largely unenforced that I can see. Your law sounds much simpler. But wow, the first thing I do when I get a new sled it to take off all the stupid warning stickers. How do they know that you have taken them off? Do they go find a like sled and compare? Silly.

Harley's vs. Sleds?

IMO the reason why sleds are busted down on and not bikes (I live in the Twin Cities, and they are getting more forceful with the noise, as they should) but you don't see people in bikes tresspassing across people's yards and property.

It is very infrequent that one gets pulled over on a sled mearly for noise (unless it is insanely loud) but they get slapped with the ticket after they did something else (speeding, tresspass, racing, etc....) and they get the noise ticket on top of it.

As far as a bike goes, many areas of the country have cracked down on it. Several years back while riding on the Blue Ridge Parkway in North Carolina I saw manditory checkpoint for noise levels.

Not ALL bikes are loud. You can sum up allot of things here. Loud stereos, crotch rockets, import racers, etc..... all are just as loud or louder. All of which have laws against, but the laws are rarely enforced as the police usually have bigger things to worry about. It is unique to the sled world that the DNR partolls it rather than the police.

With that said, LOUD closes trails, and LOUD kills performance. On bikes and sleds. If you here a bike with drag pipes, it is just like a "race" silencer. Kills power. So to sum it up, the louder they are the SLOWER they are!

Michigan law as written on the DNR (http://www.michigan.gov/dnr/0,1607,7-153-10365_14824-32293--,00.html) page:

Noise: Each snowmobile manufactured after July 1, 1977, shall be equipped with a muffler that does not exceed 78 decibels of sound pressure at 50 feet as measured by the 1974 SAEJ-192a.

Living on a state highway that is a main thoroughfare for the weekend Harley rider, I'm here to tell you that the stereos, crotch rockets, import racers, etc are not louder than a Harley (or any other brand) with drag pipes or any other type of pipe with the baffles removed. Other than the occasional really loud tractor/trailer, the Harley is the loudest of them all. I'm not saying that I don't like it, because I like the sound of most of the pipes on the road and trail today, but I'm just being realistic here. To stay away from crack-down by the law, we need to be more aware of the people around us and try a little harder to keep the non-riders happy.

how many states are gonig to ban pipes? i heard theres going to be a few. i think it's a crock! look at the harleys, their loud as hell.and they don't get bothered[/b]
thats crazy but typical of the greenies thinking they can control our lives and know what best for us than we know for ourselfs just typical and bogus
kevin :) SWRules

Living on a state highway that is a main thoroughfare for the weekend Harley rider, I'm here to tell you that the stereos, crotch rockets, import racers, etc are not louder than a Harley (or any other brand) with drag pipes or any other type of pipe with the baffles removed.[/b]

And it is a low number of bikes that actually have the baffles removed.

Well where I live the above mentioned problems are much more frequent and annoying (and daily) than a weekend bike rider. Go where the traffic goes slower and it is very annoying.

It is no more wrong in assuming that any guy with a "Harley" is just as much as a bad apple as anyone with a sled is a tresspassing, tree killing, earth warming mongrel.

I hear this comment allot about "Harleys" on the site here and I used to be in this same boat. I just dont think people realise how many "quiet" ones go by vs. "loud"

And it is a low number of bikes that actually have the baffles removed.

Well where I live the above mentioned problems are much more frequent and annoying (and daily) than a weekend bike rider. Go where the traffic goes slower and it is very annoying.

It is no more wrong in assuming that any guy with a "Harley" is just as much as a bad apple as anyone with a sled is a tresspassing, tree killing, earth warming mongrel.

I hear this comment allot about "Harleys" on the site here and I used to be in this same boat. I just dont think people realise how many "quiet" ones go by vs. "loud"[/b]


You're right, the percentage of riders with drag pipes is not that high, but I would guess it's in the 40% range that have at least altered exhaust. There are very many that go by that are very quiet. We just sit with a cocktail and watch sometimes and wave to them as they go by.

I didn't mean that bikes only go by here on weekends. It's an all day, every day thing here. I happen to live on the main highway that runs to Lake Michigan from this area and it is very heavily used by bikers. Literally hundreds, if not over a thousand sometimes, go by on a regular basis on the weekends and I'd guess near a hundred every weekday when the weather is good. I can hear them for a half mile in each direction. I bitch every time the loud ones go by, but I really do love the sound and can't wait for the day I can have one too.

I would guess it's in the 40% range that have at least altered exhaust[/b]

And I bet the number of altered sled exhausts are very close percentage wise. Some choose to buy the trail version, some choose to buy the race version.

I have a aftermarket exhaust on my bike, but it is a 2:1 version that is quiet. It is an excellent performing exhaust, but quiet was on my list when I was shopping.

Even Harley makes aftermarket exhaust with their Screaming Eagle product, but they are quiet. Louder than stock, but well withing legal regulations.

My point is that it doesn't take too many to effect the reputation of "all" the guys with "Harleys" and all the guys with "sleds".

It is like a neighbor I used to have that came to me and some friends to complain about the sleds a few years ago, saying they were too loud and annoying to him. He asked us to "not ride after 7pm". We then asked him to not start his big-block powered, wet piped Baja any later than 7pm during the summer.

Suprisingly there was no compromise that could be reached.

If one is willing to consider throwing the clamps down upon one sport vs. that of the other, then we have a big problem (No I'm not saying you are Keith, just tyring to make my point to anyone who thinks that is a good idea)

You're right, the percentage of riders with drag pipes is not that high, but I would guess it's in the 40% range that have at least altered exhaust. There are very many that go by that are very quiet. We just sit with a cocktail and watch sometimes and wave to them as they go by.

I didn't mean that bikes only go by here on weekends. It's an all day, every day thing here. I happen to live on the main highway that runs to Lake Michigan from this area and it is very heavily used by bikers. Literally hundreds, if not over a thousand sometimes, go by on a regular basis on the weekends and I'd guess near a hundred every weekday when the weather is good. I can hear them for a half mile in each direction. I ##### every time the loud ones go by, but I really do love the sound and can't wait for the day I can have one too.[/b]

I live on a rural road that connects Birch Run and St Charles and I must see 100 plus bikes a day on the weekends. I would say that the percentage with modded exhaust is much higher though in my area. If I see a bike go by that is running stock it really catches my attention. The part that really bites is that I live right on at a stop sign and can usually hear two people shouting directions at each other and then take pull away at full throttle. I don't think would be so bad if it weren't for that stop sign. I agree with Keith though, if I had a bike I would probably be right there withem :whatever:

I dont care for loud sleds but its not the pipe that makes the sled loud it the muffler/can or stinger whatever you want to call it.I have a dyno port pipe with a stock muffler and my sled is no louder than it was with the stock pipe.Whats a snowmobiler to doo if you have an older machine and cant get stock replcement exhuast?[/b]

MY THOUGHT EXACTLY

I brought this up a few times

3 friends
3 FIII 600s

1 stock
1 pipes into stock can
1 stock pipes and MBRP can

the sled with pipes and stock can is NO louder then the stock stock set up

The reason he has pipes is he wants more HP BUT runs a stock can as he does not want it loud

The 2 other guys stock pipe/can and the MBRP can one are BRAAPPERS

all they care about is making noise


So the guy with the stock pipe/can that braaps 24/7 is legal and let go

BUT the guy with the aftermarket pipe with stock can gets screwed even though he is no louder then a stock sled and does not braap

Your Dyno Port piped sled with stock can is maybe a abit tinnier in sound but is nothing like a phart can some have

I also agree what about older sleds,I know my SRV would wear out the flange area,luckily I found a used pipe

Main thing there is a diference between pipe vs muffler


Also it would be nice to see aftermarket pipes/mufflers that are quieter than stock,they have them all ready for bikes and quads why not sleds?

Should I be stopped because I do not have a GM muffler on my car

my 97 mxz 670's pipe caved in where it is supported by the upper shock mount from alot of jumping. because of the bad angle at the flange, it to wore out. i bought a psi single exhaust, pipe and silencer. i also have a 2000 mxz 500, with the stock exhaust you could not hear the 500, with the psi exhaust you can hear the 500. i also have a 94 mach-1 with twins into stock silencer, alot louder