Black Magic has the V-Force Delta III Reeds for the F7, $239. Would it be worth it for this sled. I didn't even realize you could change the reeds on an EFI? Has anyone used V-Force Reeds on their EFI in the past? What do you guys think? Thanks.

I noticed that too and was scratching my heads as to how you would change reeds on an EFI.haha *Must be some new setup or something. http://www.snowmobileworld-s2.com/forums/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif

You got me? Maybe we should email Black Magic? No one is really responding to the question. Or, no one knows the answer, or am I missing something here. I thought I had a decent understanding of the mechanics of a sled, am I asking a stupid question?? http://www.snowmobileworld-s2.com/forums/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/baaa.gif

LOL *I think we are all kinda stumped on reeds for an EFI! http://www.snowmobileworld-s2.com/forums/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif * Unless there is something similiar to a reed that is used and they are just calling it V-force reeds for the sake of name recognition.....

Just in case anyone wants to see for themselves, here is the link. http://www.blackmagicracing.com/2002pages/WhatsNew/VForce3.htm

The only other thing I can think of is that they are really only for the F5 and it just says F5/F7?

Call Black Magic techline and see what they say.

sure you can put reeds on an EFI they are the same engines as the carb models they just have a throttle body where the carbs would be other than that the engines are identical

i put v-force reeds on a 99 ZR 500 EFI and the throttle response was improved along with maybe a little mid-range power

Thanks ZR580s rule. Like I said before, this is my first EFI sled. I am not someone that does heavy mods to my sleds, but if I can safely make some small changes like reeds to the sled to give it a little boost, things that are plug-n'-play, that would be great. I sent Black Magic an email yesterday regarding the reeds. I just want to make sure these changes won't hurt the EFI.

I want to put reeds in my 00ZR600EFI too. I already have a pipe and chip clutch kit and can. I hope I will be able to see a difference, and am not wasting my money

I always thought that there was something built into the throttle body that acted like reeds since there was no carbs. Never tinkered with an EFI sled though either. *
You learn something new everyday here!haha http://www.snowmobileworld-s2.com/forums/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

my friend put some *reed on is 2002 zr800 efi and never had problem whats so ever

But did he see any improvement in performance? Is it worth the money?

For some reason everyone thinks the EFI sleds don't have reeds. I guess it would be easy to think that but i know for a fact that the EFI sleds do have reeds. I have a 98,99,02 ZR 600 EFI. All of them have reeds. I have asked about getting aftermarket reeds for them and have been told that they are not worth the money. The difference they make is not noticeable on an EFI sled. I have a friend who does alot of racing and he ran a sled on the dyno with and without the reeds and he said that there was no noticeable difference made. On a mod sled they do work but if the engine is stock they aren't worth the money. Just my $.02.

ive read alot where reeds dont really make more hp for a 5-600 sled,i put v2's on my mx800 and it made a difference,excellent throttle response,i raced a buddy at top end i would pull away,then we took the reeds out and went back on the trail,we were dead even(only 30 mins later),so for my sled they seemed to work,but its the price thats hard to justify.

How hard are they to install? Any tips?

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (arcticcatboots @ Sep. 03, 2002, 09:08am)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">How hard are they to install? Any tips?[/b][/quote]
Not sure on the EFI models, but on carb models you just pull the carbs and reed cage and replace it with the new one. *Very easy install and they come with directions. *The biggest pain with the carb models is pulling the carbs!haha *
Normaly you would jet down a few sizes also since the reeds make you run richer, but with EFI I would think that would adjust it for you to some degree.

Pantera&#39;s right...you won&#39;t get the same benefit from them on a 5-600 motor as you would on an 800 motor.
On some Cat&#39;s, you do have to cut some of the rubber flange away...but this is still easy, a straight hacksaw blade will do the trick.

Here is my question and subsequent answer from Black Magic:

Question:
Hi,
* * I have an F7 on order, it is my first EFI sled. I was not aware that EFI sleds have Reeds. Is this something new on the F7, or is this just a typo or do all EFI sleds have reeds?
Thank you for your time.

Answer:
Not all EFI sleds have reeds. *Most of the newer model vehicles have case reed induction. *It is very prominent in today&#39;s engine packages.

Sincerely,
Timothy H. Berg
President


I am learning *http://www.snowmobileworld-s2.com/forums/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/thumbs-up.gif

I have helped install vforce 2 on a couple efi 600s. *Its the same as a carb. *I disagree with saying the don&#39;t make a difference on a 5 or 6. *I have noticed no top end gains but the difference in throttle response on both an efi and a carb 5-6 is quite noticeable especially on the bottom end.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (IRON WILL @ Sep. 02, 2002, 9:08pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">For some reason everyone thinks the EFI sleds don&#39;t have reeds. I guess it would be easy to think that but i know for a fact that the EFI sleds do have reeds. I have a 98,99,02 ZR 600 EFI. All of them have reeds. I have asked about getting aftermarket reeds for them and have been told that they are not worth the money. The difference they make is not noticeable on an EFI sled. I have a friend who does alot of racing and he ran a sled on the dyno with and without the reeds and he said that there was no noticeable difference made. On a mod sled they do work but if the engine is stock they aren&#39;t worth the money. Just my $.02.[/b][/quote]
Ya Iron, I don&#39;t think they look at the decals on the hoods that say lightweight case reed twin. *ha ha

Yeah that decal is kinda a dead give away. http://www.snowmobileworld-s2.com/forums/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Honestly, I never even really noticed or thought about that decal, but you are right, that does make sense. http://www.snowmobileworld-s2.com/forums/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/baaa.gif

Yup, I smacked myself on the forehead on that one!!haha http://www.snowmobileworld-s2.com/forums/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

Just a little information note. Reeds have no relationship to EFI or Carbs. Reeds are the way that the manufacture of the engine chose to valve it. Their are several ways to valve a 2 stroke. The simplest and also now the most common is to use Reeds. Polaris used to use piston port, and skidoo used to use a rotary valve. All these methods perform one function and that is to prevent the fuel air mixture blowing out the carb or throttle body when nthe piston moves down into the crankcase and pressurizes it to force the mixture into the cylinder. It seems that the latest trend is to use reeds on the intake side and some sort of *exhaust valve (i.e. rave, power valve). In theroy new reeds should increase perfomance by allowing a larger fuel air to enter the crankcase therefore more power. I am sure that we have all tried something that was supposed to increase perfomance but actualy hurt it. Rember that if you allow mor fuel air mixture in that you also have to let it out. That is why you here the term tuned pipe.
Just my two cents. Good luck.

put vforce in all thesleds I own or owned. *efi or carb same reeds just has throttle bodies instead of carbs. *same cages and bottom ends

Thinks about it fundamentally Guys & Gals~ The reeds are "intake valves" & the carbs, throttle body & injector "atomize" fuel. *Although the spray from the injector is finer & more uniform, the function of the reeds is uneffected.

A friend of mine spent the $ on V Force 2&#39;s for his bone stock &#39;00 ZR5 EFI. The lower end seemed to respond better but the mid range felt lean from 5800-6000 or so. *The sled seemed to nose over a bit, then pick back up again. We changed the v force out for AC & sure enough, the lower end was weaker but no nose over in the mid range. http://www.snowmobileworld-s2.com/forums/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/nervous.gif He reinstalled the V-force & ran without any other issues (he was more than happy with the better lower end).

I have V-force in my 02 ZL SS my son has same sled without reeds and I take him by 2 sled in 500 ft and over 5mph. We change sleds and my sled still takes his. I put reeds in EFI&#39;s just like you do carbs, you still have to cut off the ears. I just hope my son dosen&#39;t read this because he just thinks his is ranning bad.
I have ran V-force in all my sleds and think they work well.
900T-cat,1000T-cat, 800 ZRT, ZR600, ZL600, ZR800 and ZL600ss and now F/700. :D

I am going to replace my stock reeds in my 2001 zr600efi with a set of Boyeseen Power reeds. I was wondering if anyone out there had changed their reeds and could tell me the best way to get the throttle bodies out of the way. Do you have to remove the airbox, ecu, etc? Thanks.

From experience with a riding bud&#39;s 03 F-7 efi, V-Force reeds will not show any gains but will make it run very strange at lower RPM. His first hand impressions were confirmed with dyno testing...............they don&#39;t work in the F-7.

Rick.
:christmas:

I too have heard that there is little difference at all in the vforce reeds in the f7,,,,I was getting a pair, and decided to spend my money elsewhere,,,,,someone on here posted in a previous thread that when they put the f7 on the dyno, there was very very little difference between stock reeds and the vforce,,,I am not paying over 200$ for very very little difference,,,,,