put 60 miles on it today....awesome :D

another

no racheting!!!

DRRRROOOOOOL. You are so lucky Panteraone. That looks awesome!!!! :) :thumbsup:

still have to put my running board stiffners on

thnx lady k ,should rock in the powder :D

Awesome looking skid P ....how much travel does that thing give you??? Looks like a couple feet :D Where does that setup really shine?

Very nice panteraone I love the attack angle on that thing . Large contact patch. Cant wait to see it in action. Did you have to trailer or did you ride from home?


Where's the on trail pics :(

Looks good panteraone. Give us all the details you can. I'm planning on going to a 136 xpert x next year and want to get all the information I can.

How much snow do you have there? I am dying to ride! When do the trails open?

jim travel is measured at the shock itself and gives 11"of true travel ,if you measure at the back like the others its like 17-19",this shines in the rough stuff,found a bush trail that was really banged up and the suspension worked great,it can take a pounding..


permafrost ..as the suspension collapses it actually slides back(swing arm) so you have a constant patch,and also gives a better attack angle as it compresses,we trailered out to shiers limits(zeverlys),forgot to bring the camera,we will be going out again on sunday(im putting another expert on a srx)hopefully get some riding pics

bladeguy...no trails open,just riding on oll logging roads and some bush trails

zr500, anything that you want to know specifically?

Does it have the front to rear coupling action as say the SC10II? What is the weight of the skid? Howhard was the install? I noticed a exterior plate?

Looks FN cool!!

FZ700

Nice pics Panteraone, but it looked better this morning when I snuck in to have a look!lol. You're not the only guy riding though! I took the kids tundra into work tonight. :D

fz700..it does have front to back coupling without losing weight transfer,not sure of the weight , i heard its 4 lbs lighter than a cat suspension(zr),install very easy,and also the easiest suspension i have ever seen to put back into the tunnel,just slides right in,exterior plate is needed but easy to put on

regor thnx.....i thought you had come over this morning ,i saw the parts:D hit any crossditchs on the way to work :D now get busy on that 141" :devil:

If you don't mind, how much did the skid run you? I would like to upgrade to a 136" suspension.

FZ700

Originally posted by PANTERAONE@Nov 8 2002, 08:09 PM
,not sure of the weight , i heard its 4 lbs lighter than a cat suspension(zr),i
I weighed my zr suspension the other day. Exactly 60 lbs. That ExpertX doesn't look like it should weigh 56lbs.

In your first pic, the approach angle looks really bad, really steep. Any idea what it is?

PerformanceX, after you pointed out the angle, it does look rather steep! It almost looks as if the skid should be back about a couple(2 maybe 3) inches. It does look steep. Or is it the camera angle?


FZ700

see? 60..

nice suspension.

performance...the weight is what ive read,i can not verify that,but i am putting one on a friends machine tommorrow,and ill weigh it before it goes on the sled :D as for approach angle the camera angle doesnt help,but as the suspension collapses the rails pull back,thus you will have a better angle,you really have to see it working to understand it,thats why you can run with a loose track,the suspension maintains tension throughout compression,ive only put 60 miles on it so far,and i can say that i dont miss my m-10 ohlin suspension,i did get a very good price on the skid,but thats between me and someone else and i dont feel its fair announce what i paid. :thumbsup:

Sweet Panteraone awsome looking

that looks like some kick ### suspension

SWEEEETTT... Looks great PANTERAONE.. Just checked the tracking #, mine should be here tomorrow.. Cant wait.. Im a stickler about weight so illl measure the Expert and the old SC10ii, and post the results.. What do you think of the extensions? I will probably go to 136" next year.
FZ700: Retail for the 121" is $1495.. Got mine for $1250.. The extensions are $140.





Now if the Expert shows up, then the Fabcraft arms, then a good size blizzard, Ill be all set!!

looks really nice your gonna be the evny of all this winter !!!

the extensions look good,can't see me having any problems with them,i like the 136 ill never get a 121 sled again,the 136 out handles the 121 in almost every situation IMO.. :thumbsup:

You covered most of my questions. How does it do on some of the smaller studder bumps. My biggest complaint about my AC suspension is if its stiff enough to take the big stuff it won't move the rest of the time and if its nice the rest of the time it won't take the big stuff. Also is there a good adjustment system to it. That is a solid 136 not a 121 with extensions right? I think that should about cover all my questions. Thanks.

Looks great Panteraone :D How do those skids handle with a big person on them,anyone know?I've been thinking, and for what it will cost me to upgrade to a gade
i could swap in a 136 and do a few other mods and have money left over to buy the beer while workin on it ;)
How many km are on your sled Pantera??I'm not takin much stock in this latest so-called ring problem as i know of several sleds with near 10,000km on them and they still work great.

ZR500, The X comes as a 121 w/rails. The 144" comes as solid rails and the larger sizes also. They are solid asa rock though. I talked w/Rob at the Novi show about your skid Panterone. Maybe I'll have mine sooner rather than later also. Looking for a used136x1.250 track now with no luck.
Caleb

zr500..seems to be good on the stutters i hit a patch of stutter bumps and just cruised over them my buddy on the xc 500 was bouncing all over,i only have 60 miles on it,they say 300-500 before everything loosens up :D and there are many adjustments with this skid,its really trick,theres spring preload---shock angle(ride height)--softness adjustment nut---and a weight transfer adjuster--and also a anti bottoming spring(this is so cool)...i want some more miles to practise adjustments and learning exactly what to adjust in different situations,and it is a rail extension but sure looks solid,i doubt ill ever have a problem with it :D

z800rtx..no difference with a big person just use adjustments and dial it in for yourself,thats what is so nice about this over a stock skid you can set it up so precise..i have 13100 kms,had the piston recall done at 7000 kms,and last year ate a piston at 11700kms(frozen carb)skidoo gave me a new motor(minus the case)my 2 complaints about my sled are 1 the poor recoil,i bought a 2003 recoil this year,looks good and works good hopefully this one lasts
2..the y pipe and pipe erosion....
other than that my sled has been good to me

sled dogg...theres some good deals on 136 1"3/4 and 2"tracks on the western site,all you have to do is trim the lugs down to which height that you want,1.25 is hard to find.. :thumbsup:

Originally posted by PANTERAONE@Nov 9 2002, 01:16 AM
put 60 miles on it today....awesome :D
Right on Kev,

Glad to see you're happy with everything. It's soft enough for your weight, correct?

Keep that track nice and loose (as you have it), just like I showed you on the Hawk in Toronto. Your wheel bearings/hyfax/track will last wayyy longer and you'll freewheel so much more easily.

Are you running the lowest preload setting on the shocks and the more aggressive setting on the dynamic stopper? I'd like to know just for reference.

Remember, if you ever need any tuning assistance, drop me an email, I'm always available.

-Rob

Originally posted by FZ700@Nov 9 2002, 02:02 AM
Does it have the front to rear coupling action as say the SC10II? What is the weight of the skid? Howhard was the install? I noticed a exterior plate?

Looks FN cool!!

FZ700
If I may jump in here FZ700, the Expert X's unique single swingarm design allows rotational coupling, which is something none of the other twin links can provide.

All conventional twin link suspensions (including the M10) use front to rear coupling and vertical down force to smoothen the ride, but these designs can only provide a small amount of coupling compared to our levered design. I explained this to Panteraone in Toronto, it's much easier to see when you have the skid right in front of you.

The thing just eats those annoying stutters. Yes I'm biased, but I as Panteraone has seen first hand, I'm a hardcore rider who loves this sport. I wouldn't be able to work with A.D. Boivin's Research and Development team if I didn't believe in their products.

I hope this helps you out.

-Rob

there is a few 136" tracks w/ a 1.25" lug height on tracksusa.

nice to hear from you labradorboy :) i was running least preload on shock ,dynamic stopper in top position,and softness adjustment on#4,ill be playing around with it to learn how much adj does what,so far its been great :)

now as for weight expert-x 121.....62 lbs
proaction from a 98 srx..................70lbs

both weighed on same digital scale....

ill post some srx pics a bit later on

Originally posted by Sled Dogg@Nov 9 2002, 04:18 PM
ZR500, The X comes as a 121 w/rails. The 144" comes as solid rails and the larger sizes also. They are solid asa rock though. I talked w/Rob at the Novi show about your skid Panterone. Maybe I'll have mine sooner rather than later also. Looking for a used136x1.250 track now with no luck.
Caleb
Hey Caleb, I'll be selling a 136 x 1 1/4 full block track shortly ( just have to take it off the sled) . Nothing wrong with it just changing it for 141. A buddy of mine has aleady spoken for it but if he has a change of wallet, (did I say that? I meant heart!) It will be up for grabs. ;)

Is a fully clipped track? My Ultra is fully clipped, guess I can spend a night punching it out if not lol. Send me a pm with what your looking for it. Act fast as my cash may be gone soon lol. Ordered a bunch of stuff from MCB performance today. Minor things, but my wants are starting to take over the needs lol. I ran her up and down our 18th fairway friday . She runs great!!!! And is a full block like the ones guys buy, like say a 9818? Or does that mean a solid block across? New to playing with tracks.
Caleb

LabradorBoy -

I like to ride lots of miles every day. I run into all kinds of cra@ on the trails. I am pretty agressive and I don't like to feel the bumps. I like my M10 & M16. You said it handles stutter bumps good - how about big bumps? It is stiff and transfers the little bumps to the rider? My back is a little screwed up these days, so I want to feel as little of the trail bumps as I can. I know you are biased, but try to give me a comparison to the M10.

Thanks.

srx

srx

last one

panteraone does the expert x slow you down on top end like the m-10? or vs the oem suspension (artic- fasttrack) ?how is weight transfer?

hey is that darcey`s sled?......thoes skids look pretty nice

slowhand..from several people on the net i was told no top end loss,with my m-10 i was 4-6 mph slower..did 60 miles on it but no hard pack runs to see top speed(3-4 inchs of powder + some chopped up bush trails)weight transfer is very good,ill need some side by side test runs with my buddys sled,we ride all the time and i know how i was with him with the m-10,but the expert definately transfers way better from the short use i have on it

machz69 thnx....that is don brooks sled,he has a cottage at the lake(kenagass??? i cant spell it..lol on the 144)

Cool, I can't wait to get other too. You have a great looking sled too. :thumbsup:

Originally posted by BLADEGUY@Nov 10 2002, 03:31 PM
LabradorBoy -

I like to ride lots of miles every day. I run into all kinds of cra@ on the trails. I am pretty agressive and I don't like to feel the bumps. I like my M10 & M16. You said it handles stutter bumps good - how about big bumps? It is stiff and transfers the little bumps to the rider? My back is a little screwed up these days, so I want to feel as little of the trail bumps as I can. I know you are biased, but try to give me a comparison to the M10.

Thanks.
Bladeguy,

It's always advantageous to know what's out there and how it works, so I can respect the fact that you like your M10 and M16 but are still curious about the Expert X. Different strokes for different folks.

The thing about the Expert X is that it has a "dual personality". You set the twin shock/dual rate spring combo up to handle most of the smaller (2-8") stutters on the trail, while you let the Dynamic Stopper torsion springs handle the bigger trail junk and the G-bumps that will happen, no matter how smooth the trail is.

The dynamic stopper springs won't actually engage until your last 4" of travel, at which point they really slow the motion of the suspension down and absorb the energy that would otherwise be felt as "ouch". It's this dual set-up that allows the Expert X to handle such a diversity of terrain with minimal adjustment - you set the shocks/coilover springs up to handle the stutters, you set the dynamic stopper up to handle the big ones. The adjustment of one system has no effect on the other and this is what makes the skid so easy to tune.

As for front-to-rear coupling, the Expert X has rotational coupling, which is only possible with a single swingarm design and has a much greater effect quality than the coupling provided by any other conventional twin link design; the rails cannot rotate about two links.

Weight transfer is unparalleled. Tool less adjustment rocks when you want to make a fast tweak and smoke your buddies across a lake. Ride height adjustment also comes in handy if you want to blast a smooth trail on a Sunday morning and do not need all of that travel. It takes about 1 minute to go from full high to full low. It's not an adjustment you will make everyday, but it's there and it's easy enough to do.

Track tension is insanely loose; I even freak myself out sometimes looking at it. Panteraone has about 2.5-3" of loose sag at the midpoint of his rail, which is fairly typical. That loose track tension is consistent throughout the suspension stroke, so you never have to worry about ratcheting or losing top end. I've actually gained 2-3 mph on top end on several chassis that I've used in the past few years. Currently, I have guys running 159's/156's/151's in the West and none of them are running antiratchet drivers - they all run as loose as Panteraone or more.

I hope this is a clear explanation. If you have any questions at all, feel free to drop me a line.

-Rob

Pantera your doing a great job with all the free advertisement on your doo. :withstupid: :(

Thanks for the info. I guess the only way to know for sure is to try one. I had heard a lot about the M10 before I bought. I have not heard a lot about the Expert X.

Originally posted by PANTERAONE@Nov 8 2002, 10:39 PM
as for approach angle the camera angle doesnt help,but as the suspension collapses the rails pull back,
Alright, that's the second time you mentioned that. I let it go the first time, but now I'm getting irritated. The darn approach angle improves as ANY suspension collapses. Imagine your stock suspension, completely collapsed, squished up into the tunnel. The track would be near horizontal across the 7-9 inch span from the bottom of the driver to the first point of contact on the rail. Sheesh!

performancex....why irritated??you are correct, but track tension would not be maintained with your scenerio,fully collapse an m-10 in powder...guess what ratchet big time unless your track is so tight,then you start blowing rear idler wheel bearings cause the track is to tight,the expert allows you to run a loose track,so as it collapses it also maintains track tension and a better approach angle,what good is a approach angle when the suspension collapses and you start to ratchet?until you try one how can you be negative?sheesh!!

I wasn't trying to say anything negative about the ExpertX or any suspension..I was just pointing out that you highlighted the fact that the approach angle of the EX improves as it collapses, when this fact is true for any suspension. Again, no offense.

The sleds look awesome. Just curious about srx. Will you have to put in a long travel front end? How much does the suspension sag with rider on seat? How much do you weigh? I have an srx as well and am looking to upgrade. Just wondering how it rides without upgrading the front? Also, the pix of the srx, is the suspension fully extended or is that at the lower setting? Looks like he'll have to readjust his headlight. :)