I've seen them used and throughroly abused! They need to be a Good brand and in the center of the track. Proper instalation is a must. Now in a 150+hp sled I can't say but I'd try them as thay cost so little even if you loose several. You'lll pick up alot of track horsepower by dropping the weight.
I'm with arcticzrt600 and rx-1 on this one. I don't think the looss of the weight of the backers is going to be a noticable difference. Why change away from what we all know works. I don't know what sled you ride, but I think you would see a much more noticable difference in a low HP sled. If you are running a sub 100HP sled, then maybe it would be beneficial.
Well, I look at it this way. If plastic was the way to go, then why don't the stud. manufactures make them? A steel or metal backer will bend and get ya home, where as plastic will bend and let the stud dome out, and this can lead to a damaged track.
Even Woody's doesn't recomend alum, for trail riding.
I know of some friends who have used plastic backers and have found after a couple hundered miles of riding they will loosen up enough for the studs to turn in the track. This will lead to a pull-thru. When they tried to tighten them, they stripped out.
I used to run steel for years with only a corner bend now and then. Switched to alum. and 60% were bent all to he!! before the end of the season.
Next tried saber plastic backers and had 0 problems or 0 complaints [well saber studs are worth complaining about]
Next tried the round plastic backer with the built in nut also plastic cant remember the name but they held up just great! I thought they would strip out but nota one.
I run a paddle track now and dont miss studs one little bit!!!
Here are some figures I had wrote down:
192 one piece studs with 5/16 lock nut and steel backer 12#
Same with alum. backers 8#
Same with plastic backers 6#
Quite a difference from plastic to steel! What was that figure? For every pound of rotating mass = ?? of H.P.
And who said the weight between steel and plastic isnt noticeable is smok'in something.
And all these experiences were done with the massive power of the Rotax [mostly tripple's]
Mikadoo... I never said anything about not noticing a difference between the weight of plastic and steel backers!! I was referencing the weight difference between plastic and aluminum.
I believe the statement that 2dooski made was " i have woodys aluminum backers was thinking of switching to plastic. " I don't see ANYTHING about steel there. Do you?
And I'm with Mighty RX-1 about the durability of aluminum backers. I have thousands of miles logged with aluminum backers. I have never damaged one either. But then, ask anyone I ride with...I drive like a grammaw.
idooski... Your right, nothing was said about steel I was just comparing all three materials and giving a weight comparison.
It was stated that no noticable difference was noticed in speed. It does'nt matter what hp sled you have, rotating weight robs hp and speed. I have seen the figures before on this site, does anyone have them? It was quite a bit if I remember right.....
What everyone has to realise is that the durability is the brand of the products. While some guys bend alum. backers, others don't.
When people go to the snow shows and buy these studs with backers for like $1.25 or $1.40, I feel bad for them. I am sure someone has had luck with them, but all of my friends that did regreted it. There alum. backers all bent, pulling thru there track, and I bet 80% of there studs were not just bent but broken off.
Of course there is no stud that will take everything, but this is one area where I think if people should spend some more $$ for better products.
Like idooski and mxzwfo have seen are what I use for trail studs, the most durable setup that one can find. I use Woody's Tnut 30 deg drag picks with steel backers. I use this setup in the trails, and it is absolutely the toughest setup out there, and cheap.
This is a pic of my 800 last year with the stock track. These studs have 1800miles of trail riding and grass drags on it, not one bent stud. The very tip of the studs rounded quickly, but they hook up allot better than the gold diggers because they are all thinner profile.
800mxz, steel is tough no dought about it. The weight is the problem.
I have 240 new steel backers by Liberty for sale, would you like to buy them? I go to three swap meets a year to sell-buy stuff and cant give them away!
Running this setup is lighter than any carbide stud of the same length. T nuts are lighter than the heads of a push thru, there is allot less metal in a 30 deg. stud than a trail stud (stud is thinner) and there is no carbide or nuts. Go to a dealer and pick up a bag of 96 1" studs with a bag of alum. backers, and pickup a bag 96 1" drag studs with steel backers. It is allot lighter.
The setup will be lighter than carbide studs with plastic backers, and many times more durable. I have done allot of differnt things with studs, and ride with allot of guys from Woody's. I ran into this when one of the R+D guys were doing the same.
Has anybody ever tried those double backers? I am thinking of trying them out but I am not sure if they are all they are cracked up to be. If they pull through, there will be a HUGE hole in the track compared to a single stud. Any info?
I am not sure what is better for conditions in general after last year.
I weigh 220 and drive it hard.
Last years attitude was [email protected]$# IT ALL! due to the lousy conditions.
My '02 800 saw the works last year: rock, stumps, frozen dirt, asphalt and all plastic washers remained intact. Of course they deflect but that is what probably saves the track on unfriendly surfaces.
.to those knocking the plastic backer for durability do you run plastic skis on your sleds or are you running steel,the steel will not break or flex like the plastic.I have some steel skis I will trade for your new plastic ones that might break
.anyhow I have one buddy that has over 2700miles with the plastic backers and one that has the round one with nuts built in like Mikadoo talked about(it has 2000 miles) and neither one had any losses or complaints about them.I have always run allum. backers without problems myself but I will be looking at plastic next time around.
A forum community dedicated to snowmobile owners and enthusiasts. Come join the discussion about performance, troubleshooting, trails, maintenance, riding tips, modifications, classifieds, accessories, and more!